Comments on: Todd Bentley and John Crowder http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder Trying to make safe spaces for diverse and healthy conversations about church. Sun, 20 Dec 2009 13:00:21 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Bill Campbell http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14886 Bill Campbell Sun, 20 Dec 2009 13:00:21 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14886 People who turn up <strong>drunk</strong> at work <strong>get fired</strong>. People who <strong>get drunk</strong> with “familiar spirits” from Lucifer will <strong>get fired</strong> into the lake of fire, if they don’t <strong>repent</strong> prior. John Crowder’s “<strong>heavy, weighty</strong>, drunken glory” may be a premonition of the <strong>weight of a millstone</strong>: Luke 17:1-2 Jesus said to his disciples: "Things that cause people to sin are bound to come, but woe to that person through whom they come. It would be better for him to be thrown into the sea with a <strong>millstone tied around his neck</strong> than for him to cause one of these little ones to sin. John Crowder’s mocking ministry is not to the unsaved, as they would be repulsed by his bizarre acts which are <strong>identical to mental illness</strong> or drunken / drugged. John’s ministry is to cause <strong>corruption of existing christians</strong> by encouraging them to mock God with improper revelry, and form relationships with Satan’s minions, “familiar spirits”, and so reclaim Christians for the Devil. 1 John 4:1 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. Matthew 24:10-13 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and <strong>many false prophets</strong> will appear and <strong>deceive many people</strong>. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but <strong>he who stands firm</strong> to the end will be saved. Getting <strong>drunk</strong> and <strong>falling down</strong> is the opposite of <strong>standing firm</strong>. The “slain in the spirit” (falling down) phenomena is not from God of Gen 1:1, it is from “god of this age” 2 Cor 4:4 The only exception is falling down after being killed by God for wrongdoing (eg. Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5:1-11). Slain means being killed. Instead of teaching people to <strong>fear the lord</strong>, John Crowder is teaching them to treat God as an object to be indulged, like a prostitute for sex lust and drunken dissipation. It is deception and blasphemy to associate these immoralities with “the joy of the Lord” mentioned in the Bible. Rom 13:12-14 The night is far spent, the day is at hand. Therefore let us <strong>cast off</strong> the works of darkness, and let us put on the armor of light. Let us <strong>walk properly</strong>, as in the day, <strong>not in revelry and drunkenness, not in lewdness and lust</strong>, not in strife and envy. But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to fulfill its lusts. Manifestations from “familiar spirits” might feel good, but <strong>immoral activities</strong> always do <strong>feel good</strong>, such as drunkenness, drug taking, and fornication/adultery. Following mystical ways is involvement in the <strong> magic arts </strong> (mystical = mystery). The only response from participators is either accepting the certainty of <strong>damnation</strong> to Hell, or <strong>repenting</strong> while there is still opportunity. Rev 21:8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the <strong>vile</strong>, the murderers, the <strong>sexually immoral</strong>, those who <strong>practice magic arts</strong>, the <strong>idolaters</strong> and all <strong>liars</strong> --their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death. Proverbs 14:12, 16:25 There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death 1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. Psalm 111:10-112:1 The <strong>fear of the lord</strong> is the beginning of wisdom; all who follow his precepts have good understanding. To him belongs eternal praise. Praise the LORD. Blessed is the man who <strong>fears the lord</strong>, who finds great delight in his commands. People who turn up drunk at work get fired.

People who get drunk with “familiar spirits” from Lucifer will get fired into the lake of fire, if they don’t repent prior.

John Crowder’s “heavy, weighty, drunken glory” may be a premonition of the weight of a millstone:

Luke 17:1-2 Jesus said to his disciples: “Things that cause people to sin are bound to come, but woe to that person through whom they come. It would be better for him to be thrown into the sea with a millstone tied around his neck than for him to cause one of these little ones to sin.

John Crowder’s mocking ministry is not to the unsaved, as they would be repulsed by his bizarre acts which are identical to mental illness or drunken / drugged.

John’s ministry is to cause corruption of existing christians by encouraging them to mock God with improper revelry, and form relationships with Satan’s minions, “familiar spirits”, and so reclaim Christians for the Devil.

1 John 4:1 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.

Matthew 24:10-13 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.

Getting drunk and falling down is the opposite of standing firm.

The “slain in the spirit” (falling down) phenomena is not from God of Gen 1:1, it is from “god of this age” 2 Cor 4:4
The only exception is falling down after being killed by God for wrongdoing (eg. Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5:1-11). Slain means being killed.

Instead of teaching people to fear the lord, John Crowder is teaching them to treat God as an object to be indulged, like a prostitute for sex lust and drunken dissipation.

It is deception and blasphemy to associate these immoralities with “the joy of the Lord” mentioned in the Bible.

Rom 13:12-14 The night is far spent, the day is at hand. Therefore let us cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armor of light. Let us walk properly, as in the day, not in revelry and drunkenness, not in lewdness and lust, not in strife and envy. But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to fulfill its lusts.

Manifestations from “familiar spirits” might feel good, but immoral activities always do feel good, such as drunkenness, drug taking, and fornication/adultery.

Following mystical ways is involvement in the magic arts (mystical = mystery).

The only response from participators is either accepting the certainty of damnation to Hell, or repenting while there is still opportunity.

Rev 21:8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars –their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.

Proverbs 14:12, 16:25 There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

Psalm 111:10-112:1 The fear of the lord is the beginning of wisdom; all who follow his precepts have good understanding. To him belongs eternal praise.
Praise the LORD. Blessed is the man who fears the lord, who finds great delight in his commands.

]]> By: Jonathan CHM http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14865 Jonathan CHM Tue, 28 Jul 2009 00:38:18 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14865 HOLY LAUGHER, HOLY BARK, HOLY DRUNKARD & ETC.  Holy Laughter, holy bark, holy drunkard and etc. are not found in the book of Acts during the Pentecost. Some Charismatic churches might use the word, leap, laugh, drunkard and etc. from the Old and New Testaments to support these movements. However, bear in mind that the word, leap, laugh, drunkard and etc. are mentioned instead of the full phrase of holy laughter, holy bark and etc. What if these practices are not from the work of the Holy Spirit, the insisting that these practices are from the work of Holy Spirit has caused one to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit and it would have grieved the Holy Spirit to accept the wrong saying that these are the work of them. However, the Holy Spirit does not do it. One has indeed blaspheme against the Holy Spirit by abusing the name of the Holy Spirit despite he does not do it. The blasphemy against the Holy Spirit cannot be forgivable according to the New Testament DEFINITION OF BLASPHEMY IN HEBREWS/GREEK blas’-fe-mi (blaphemia) in classical Greek and Hebrews means primarily ‘defamation’ or ‘evil-speaking’in general; ‘a word of evil omen’, hence, ‘impious, and irreverent speech against God’. The above is the extract pertaining to the meaning of blasphemy in Greek. Consider carefully about holy bark, holy laugher and etc. For instance, if these are not the work of Holy Spirit, the abusing the name of Holy Spirit by saying that these are the work of Holy Spirit is indeed delivery of irreverent speech against the Holy Spirit. For instance, if these are not the work of the Holy Spirit, the insisting that these should be directed from the work of the Holy Spirit might have abused the name of the Holy Spirit and caused defamation of its name and one might have in turn grieved the Holy Spirit since these might not be the work of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit might be ended up to bear the name for the doer of holy bark, holy laugher and etc. What if it has grieved the Holy Spirit by insisting that these are the work of the Holy Spirit, our ignorance has ultimately caused the ultimate abusing and/or blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. HEALINGS IN CONTEMPORARY CHARISMATIC CHURCHES In miraculous healings among Charismatic churches today, we could easily spot out that many sick will fall down before the healers lay hands on them. However, many sick would remain unhealed after the rally despite they did fall down before the healers, i.e. Pastors that perform miraculous healings. God is definitely powerful and can heal all kinds of sicknesses. However, there is a deficiency in the healings in contemporary Charismatic world. What if the wonders are not the work of the Holy Spirit, the commenting to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit that it is he that does the work might have grieved the Holy Spirit in case if these are not the work of the Holy Spirit and it ends up that one has abused the name of the Holy Spirit and has ultimately blasphemed against the Holy Spirit. ALL BLASPHEMIES WHETHER TOWARDS THE HOLY SPIRIT OR GOD OR JESUS CHRIST ARE TO BE CONSIDERED AS SINS Matthew 12:31-32, “Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the BLASPHEMY AGAINST the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speak against a word the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever SPEAK AGAINST the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.” As the phrase, speak against the Holy Spirit, is mentioned in Matthew 12:31-32 with the phrase, blasphemy against the Spirit, it implies that a person blasphemes against the Holy Spirit even if he speaks against the Holy Spirit. The same for abusing the name of the Holy Spirit in which it might have grieved the Holy Spirit to accept the false saying what if the works are not from the Holy Spirit. The word, forgiven, is mentioned in Matthew 12:31-32 with the phrase, every sin & blasphemy, it implies that all blasphemies are to be considered as sin or else why we should need God’s forgiveness for the blasphemies. The same in abusing God’s or Jesus’ name to support their miracles are from God or Jesus respectively and these are the acts of blasphemies to be considered as sins too. THE  WELL-KNOWN VERSES IN MATTHEW 7:21-23 Matthew 7:21-23, “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you who practise lawlessness!” What are the elements could be found in these verses above? There are: 1) They believe in Jesus Christ since Matthew 7:22, “(mentions that) Many will say to me..’LORD, LORD”. These people must have believed in Jesus Christ or else how they could call Jesus Christ to be their Lord as mentioned above then. 2) These people could use Jesus’ name to perform miracles since Matthew 7:22, “(mentions that) Many…have..prophesied…in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?” 3) Will they be accepted by Jesus Christ? Matthew 7:23, “…I will declare to them, I never knew you; depart from me”. THE PRIDE AMONG CONTEMPORARY CHURCHES FOR THEIR NON-REPENTANCE This is my general discovery upon Charismatic churches: Some Charismatic churches might not repent in order to do away their so-called, gift, in the churches due to they feel thieir reputations are most precious than the truth of the Bible and that causes them to persist in the practice. However, bear in mind that the insisting the so-called, gift, in their churches to be the work of the Holy Spirit might cause them to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit and that causes them ultimately to blaspheme against the Holy Spirit what if the miracles are not from the work the Holy Spirit. The act of insisting to defend their reputation more important than the truth of the Bible has indeed violated the great commandment of the Lord. For Matthew 22:37, “(mentions that) Jesus said to him, ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.” The act of having a high preference for their reputations rather that upholding the truth of the Bible implies that his love towards his own reputation is more significance than his love towards God.  For Matthew 22:37 has commanded us to put our love to God first instead of that has to be in replacement of our reputation. HOLY LAUGHER, HOLY BARK, HOLY DRUNKARD & ETC.

 Holy Laughter, holy bark, holy drunkard and etc. are not found in the book of Acts during the Pentecost. Some Charismatic churches might use the word, leap, laugh, drunkard and etc. from the Old and New Testaments to support these movements. However, bear in mind that the word, leap, laugh, drunkard and etc. are mentioned instead of the full phrase of holy laughter, holy bark and etc. What if these practices are not from the work of the Holy Spirit, the insisting that these practices are from the work of Holy Spirit has caused one to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit and it would have grieved the Holy Spirit to accept the wrong saying that these are the work of them. However, the Holy Spirit does not do it. One has indeed blaspheme against the Holy Spirit by abusing the name of the Holy Spirit despite he does not do it. The blasphemy against the Holy Spirit cannot be forgivable according to the New Testament

DEFINITION OF BLASPHEMY IN HEBREWS/GREEK

blas’-fe-mi (blaphemia) in classical Greek and Hebrews means primarily ‘defamation’ or ‘evil-speaking’in general; ‘a word of evil omen’, hence, ‘impious, and irreverent speech against God’. The above is the extract pertaining to the meaning of blasphemy in Greek. Consider carefully about holy bark, holy laugher and etc. For instance, if these are not the work of Holy Spirit, the abusing the name of Holy Spirit by saying that these are the work of Holy Spirit is indeed delivery of irreverent speech against the Holy Spirit. For instance, if these are not the work of the Holy Spirit, the insisting that these should be directed from the work of the Holy Spirit might have abused the name of the Holy Spirit and caused defamation of its name and one might have in turn grieved the Holy Spirit since these might not be the work of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit might be ended up to bear the name for the doer of holy bark, holy laugher and etc. What if it has grieved the Holy Spirit by insisting that these are the work of the Holy Spirit, our ignorance has ultimately caused the ultimate abusing and/or blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

HEALINGS IN CONTEMPORARY CHARISMATIC CHURCHES

In miraculous healings among Charismatic churches today, we could easily spot out that many sick will fall down before the healers lay hands on them. However, many sick would remain unhealed after the rally despite they did fall down before the healers, i.e. Pastors that perform miraculous healings. God is definitely powerful and can heal all kinds of sicknesses. However, there is a deficiency in the healings in contemporary Charismatic world. What if the wonders are not the work of the Holy Spirit, the commenting to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit that it is he that does the work might have grieved the Holy Spirit in case if these are not the work of the Holy Spirit and it ends up that one has abused the name of the Holy Spirit and has ultimately blasphemed against the Holy Spirit.

ALL BLASPHEMIES WHETHER TOWARDS THE HOLY SPIRIT OR GOD OR JESUS CHRIST ARE TO BE CONSIDERED AS SINS

Matthew 12:31-32, “Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the BLASPHEMY AGAINST the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speak against a word the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever SPEAK AGAINST the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.” As the phrase, speak against the Holy Spirit, is mentioned in Matthew 12:31-32 with the phrase, blasphemy against the Spirit, it implies that a person blasphemes against the Holy Spirit even if he speaks against the Holy Spirit. The same for abusing the name of the Holy Spirit in which it might have grieved the Holy Spirit to accept the false saying what if the works are not from the Holy Spirit. The word, forgiven, is mentioned in Matthew 12:31-32 with the phrase, every sin & blasphemy, it implies that all blasphemies are to be considered as sin or else why we should need God’s forgiveness for the blasphemies. The same in abusing God’s or Jesus’ name to support their miracles are from God or Jesus respectively and these are the acts of blasphemies to be considered as sins too.

THE  WELL-KNOWN VERSES IN MATTHEW 7:21-23

Matthew 7:21-23, “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you who practise lawlessness!”
What are the elements could be found in these verses above? There are:
1) They believe in Jesus Christ since Matthew 7:22, “(mentions that) Many will say to me..’LORD, LORD”. These people must have believed in Jesus Christ or else how they could call Jesus Christ to be their Lord as mentioned above then.
2) These people could use Jesus’ name to perform miracles since Matthew 7:22, “(mentions that) Many…have..prophesied…in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?”
3) Will they be accepted by Jesus Christ? Matthew 7:23, “…I will declare to them, I never knew you; depart from me”.

THE PRIDE AMONG CONTEMPORARY CHURCHES FOR THEIR NON-REPENTANCE

This is my general discovery upon Charismatic churches: Some Charismatic churches might not repent in order to do away their so-called, gift, in the churches due to they feel thieir reputations are most precious than the truth of the Bible and that causes them to persist in the practice. However, bear in mind that the insisting the so-called, gift, in their churches to be the work of the Holy Spirit might cause them to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit and that causes them ultimately to blaspheme against the Holy Spirit what if the miracles are not from the work the Holy Spirit. The act of insisting to defend their reputation more important than the truth of the Bible has indeed violated the great commandment of the Lord. For Matthew 22:37, “(mentions that) Jesus said to him, ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.” The act of having a high preference for their reputations rather that upholding the truth of the Bible implies that his love towards his own reputation is more significance than his love towards God.  For Matthew 22:37 has commanded us to put our love to God first instead of that has to be in replacement of our reputation.

]]> By: Jonathan CHM http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14864 Jonathan CHM Tue, 28 Jul 2009 00:37:44 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14864 Charismatic people might argue that love and the so-called, gift, could exist side by side in Charismatic churches. They might argue that Charismatic people have more love than non-Charismatic people since their love extends even to every household since they exercise miraculous healings publicly so as many people could be healed from their illnesses. Not only that, they could even take that opportunity to preach to non-Christians through rallies. They could even condemn non-Charismatic churches since they are not so actively involved in preaching as compared to Charismatic churches. John Calvin spoke in tongues. Acts 2:8-10, “And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born? Parthians, Medes….” From the above verses, we know that tongues are indeed languages and/or dialects. Do you know whether John Calvin spoke in foreign languages and/or dialects? If you could not prove whether he spoke in languages and/or dialects, we could not ascertain whether John Calvin was speaking in tongues or he just speaks nonsensical words. Bear in mind, tongues in the book of Acts are languages/dialects. If a person speaks not in foreign languages/dialects, he simply speaks garbage and not in tongues. 1 Corinthians 14;21, “in the law it is written, ‘With (men of) other tongues and other lips will I speak with this people and yet for all that will they not hear me’, saith the Lord.” As the phrase, other tongues, is mentioned in 1 Corinth 14:21 with the phrase, I speak with this people, it implies that tongues are definitely languages and/or dialects or else how God could converse with us then. 1 Corinth 14:2, “for that speaketh in an (unknown) tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God, for no man understandeth (him)…”. For 1 Corinth 14:4, “He that speaketh in an (unknown) tongue edifieth himself…”. For instance, if tongues are not languages and/or dialects and it cannot be understood by the speaker, how the tongues could edify the speaker himself since 1 Corinth 14:4 mentions that tongues have to edify the speaker. 1 Corinth 14:10, “There are, it may be, so many kinds of voices in the world, and none of them (is) without significant.” As the phrase, many kind of voices, is mentioned in 1 Corinth 14:10 with the phrase, the world, it definitely refers to languages and/or dialects in the world instead of outside the world, ie. alien language. McArthur claimed to have other tongues that could not be understood by human beings are not biblical. What if the so-called, tongues, in contemporary Charismatic churches are not from the work of the Holy Spirit, the comment that their tongues are from God or the Holy Spirit or Jesus Christ would cause one to abuse the name of them and it in turn blasphemes any one of them. 1 Corinth 14;14, “For if I pray in an (unknown) tongue pray that he may interpret”. The above verse demands a tongue spoker to pray for his understanding of tongues. 1 Corinth 14;37, “If any man think himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord”. The phrase, the things that I write to you, in 1 Corinth 14:37 is in present tense and it implies that the words that Paul just delivered for his message to the Church of Corinthians is indeed God’s commandment and this includes 1 Corinth 14:14. 1 Corinth 14:15, “What is it then? I will pray with the Spirit, and I will pray with understanding also; I will sing with Spirit, and I will sing with understanding also.” For instance, the speaker could not understand the tongue, how could they sing and pray with understanding and this contradicts 1 Corinth 14:15. Charismatic people might argue that love and the so-called, gift, could exist side by side in Charismatic churches. They might argue that Charismatic people have more love than non-Charismatic people since their love extends even to every household since they exercise miraculous healings publicly so as many people could be healed from their illnesses. Not only that, they could even take that opportunity to preach to non-Christians through rallies. They could even condemn non-Charismatic churches since they are not so actively involved in preaching as compared to Charismatic churches.

John Calvin spoke in tongues. Acts 2:8-10, “And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born? Parthians, Medes….” From the above verses, we know that tongues are indeed languages and/or dialects. Do you know whether John Calvin spoke in foreign languages and/or dialects? If you could not prove whether he spoke in languages and/or dialects, we could not ascertain whether John Calvin was speaking in tongues or he just speaks nonsensical words. Bear in mind, tongues in the book of Acts are languages/dialects. If a person speaks not in foreign languages/dialects, he simply speaks garbage and not in tongues.

1 Corinthians 14;21, “in the law it is written, ‘With (men of) other tongues and other lips will I speak with this people and yet for all that will they not hear me’, saith the Lord.” As the phrase, other tongues, is mentioned in 1 Corinth 14:21 with the phrase, I speak with this people, it implies that tongues are definitely languages and/or dialects or else how God could converse with us then.

1 Corinth 14:2, “for that speaketh in an (unknown) tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God, for no man understandeth (him)…”. For 1 Corinth 14:4, “He that speaketh in an (unknown) tongue edifieth himself…”. For instance, if tongues are not languages and/or dialects and it cannot be understood by the speaker, how the tongues could edify the speaker himself since 1 Corinth 14:4 mentions that tongues have to edify the speaker.

1 Corinth 14:10, “There are, it may be, so many kinds of voices in the world, and none of them (is) without significant.” As the phrase, many kind of voices, is mentioned in 1 Corinth 14:10 with the phrase, the world, it definitely refers to languages and/or dialects in the world instead of outside the world, ie. alien language. McArthur claimed to have other tongues that could not be understood by human beings are not biblical.

What if the so-called, tongues, in contemporary Charismatic churches are not from the work of the Holy Spirit, the comment that their tongues are from God or the Holy Spirit or Jesus Christ would cause one to abuse the name of them and it in turn blasphemes any one of them.

1 Corinth 14;14, “For if I pray in an (unknown) tongue pray that he may interpret”. The above verse demands a tongue spoker to pray for his understanding of tongues. 1 Corinth 14;37, “If any man think himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord”. The phrase, the things that I write to you, in 1 Corinth 14:37 is in present tense and it implies that the words that Paul just delivered for his message to the Church of Corinthians is indeed God’s commandment and this includes 1 Corinth 14:14.

1 Corinth 14:15, “What is it then? I will pray with the Spirit, and I will pray with understanding also; I will sing with Spirit, and I will sing with understanding also.” For instance, the speaker could not understand the tongue, how could they sing and pray with understanding and this contradicts 1 Corinth 14:15.

]]> By: Jonathan CHM http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14863 Jonathan CHM Tue, 28 Jul 2009 00:37:08 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14863 1) The following are the proves that angels could perform miracles healing and there are falling angels in the Scripture to be against God too: John 5:3-4, “In these lay a great multitude of impotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.” 2) The following are the proves that Angels could perform marvellous wonders: Luke 1:7, “And they had no child, because that Elizabeth was barren and they both were now well stricken in years.” Luke 1:13, “but the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for their prayer is heard; and they wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John”. Luke 1:18, “And Zacharias said unto the angel, ‘Whereby shall I know this? for I am an old man, and my life well stricken in years.” Luke 1:19, “And THE ANGEL ANSWERING UNTO HIM, I AM GRABRIEL…” Luke 1:20, “AND BEHOLD, THOU SHALL BE DUMB, AND NOT ABLE TO SPEAK, UNTIL THE DAY THAT THESE THINGS SHALL BE PERFORMED, because thou believest not my words, which shall be fulfilled in their season.” Luke 1:22, “And when he came out, HE COULD NOT SPEAK UNTO THEM”. Matthews 28:1-2, “Now after the Sabbath, as the first day of the week began to dawn, Many Magdalene and the other Mary came to see the tomb. And, behold, THERE WAS A GREAT EARTHQUAKE, FOR AN ANGEL OF THE LORD DESCENDED FROM HEAVEN, AND ROLLED BACK THE STONE OF THE DOOR, and sat it.” Acts 12:23, “Then immediately an angel of the Lord struck him, because he did not give glory to God. And he was eaten by worms and died.” 3) Angels could appear in somebody’s dream: Matthews 2:19, “…an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph…”; Matthew 1:20, “…an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream…” As angels could perform wonders, are there any strongest proves to show that those wonders in contemporary Charismatic Churches are from God? If someone in contemporary Charismatic Church could prove it, we have to accept it. However, if nobody could prove whether the existence of wonder in contemporary Charismatic Churches is from God or the Holy Spirit or Angels, there is a danger that one would comment that certain wonders are from God or from the Holy Spirit or from Jesus Christ and, in case if they are not and it would turn up that we have forced God or Jesus Christ or the Holy Spirit to bear the name of doer and indirectly we have abused the name of Jesus Christ or God or the Holy Spirit and this causes us to speak against Jesus Christ or God or the Holy Spirit indirectly. Could contemporary Charismatic Church claim that the miracles and wonder they perform in the name of Jesus Christ, is accompanied by correct teaching (in accordance with God’s Word) and righteous living? A good Christian performs a wonder through the name of Jesus Christ in the Church. Many audiences would claim that this be the work of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit. As fallen angels could perform wonders, i.e. Buddhists could perform wonders as it is listed in the Internet too. What if the wonders in contemporary Charismatic churches are not from God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit, the surrounding audience that claims to be the work of the Holy Spirit/God/Jesus Christ, would have indirectly abused the name of each of them even though they might not be the one to do it and it indirectly causes the defamation of the name of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit and they might have grieved as a result of the whole church speaking against them since they might not do it. The abusing of the name of Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit/God would cause the audience to commit continual sins as when and they address these be the work of God. Can a Christian or a Catholics claim that he has followed the correct teaching and righteous living when day by day and month by month and year by year seeing people keep on claiming the wonders in contemporary Charismatic Churches to be the work of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit without telling them the danger that they would have sinned against God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit what if the so-called, wonders, might not be their work then? For holy bark, you could see people running around the churches crazily to bark here and there. For Holy laughter, you could see people laugh without stopping. For manifestation of the Spirit, you see people roll from one place to another without knowing what he/she has done after performing. All these are not mentioned in the book of Acts. A number of people in the church mention that they receive revelation from God through words of knowledge, prophecy, tongues speaking, words of wisdom. Many prophets arose previously claimed that year 2000 and 1987 were the end of the world. However, the year before year 2000 and 1987, none of these people that claim to receive so-called, special gifts of the Holy Spirit, say that these years 2000 and 1987 are not the end of the world. If it is the work of the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit should have informed all these people to correct their mistakes. LUKE 9:49-50 ABOUT THOSE THAT DO NOT FOLLOW JESUS BUT COULD PERFORM WONDERS IN JESUS' NAME Luke 9:49, 50 (TCNT), "Hereupon John said: “Sir, we saw a man driving out demons by using your name, and we tried to prevent him, because he does not follow you with us.” “None of you must prevent him,” Jesus said to John; “he who is not against you is for you.” Were these people that were mentioned in Luke 9:49-50 to be the disciples of Jesus since it is mentioned that they did not follow Jesus? The following are the verses to prove that God's people would surely follow Jesus: John 10:27, “My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.” John 10:3, “To him the porter openeth, and the sheep hear his voice; and he calleth his own sheep by nam, and leadeth them out”. From the above verses, it is obvious that the sheep will surely follow the shepherd, Jesus. As the phrase, he is not against you is for you, is mentioned in Luke 9:49 instead of the phrase, he is not against you is for me Jesus, it does not show that all these people that could use Jesus to perform miracles were for Jesus but for us, disciples, especially Jesus had mentioned clearly in John 10:27 and 10:3 that Christians would surely follow Jesus. The possible interpetation for Luk 9:49 for him to mention that they were for us that it might be that they could assist us in bringing outsiders to the attention of Jesus Christ for our evangelism. However, they are not for Jesus since they do not follow Jesus since they would definitely follow Jesus if they are for Jesus. Indeed the people as mentioned in Luke 9:49-50 that could perform wonders in Jesus’s name were not God’s people or else Jesus should have included these people ont top of the twelve disciples. Or in other words, if these people that could perform wonders in Jesus’ name were God’s people, there would be more that twelve disciples instead of remaining to be twelve all the time during Jesus’ mission and it proves the fact that Jesus’ name could be abused to perform miracles. Or in other words, despite these people as mentioned in Luke 9:49-50 were not following Jesus and were not the disciples of Jesus, they could use Jesus’ name to perform wonders. CASTING OUT DEMONS MIGHT NOT NECESSARILY CAUSE ONE TO HAVE DISTURBED BY DEMONS AS MENTIONED IN ACTS 19:13-16: Matthew 17:15-16, “Lord have mercy on my son: for he is lunatick, and sore vexed: for ofttimes he falleth into the fire, and oft into the water. And I brought him to thy disciples, and they could not cure him.” Matthew 17:18-19, “And Jesus rebuked the devil and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour. Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, ‘Why could not we cast him out?’ ” Matthew 17:21, “Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.” From these verses, it is obvious that the failure in casting out demons might not necessarily cause one to be disturbed by demons as that is mentioned in Luke 9:49-50. PROOF THAT ANGELS COULD PERFORM MIRACULOUS HEALING AND THERE ARE FALLEN ANGELS TOO: John 5:3-4, “In these lay a great multitude of impotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.”” From John 5:3-4, it shows that angels could heal various kinds of illnesses whether they are blinded, halt and withered. As angels could perform miraculous healings and there are so-called, fallen angels, it is irrational to jump into conclusion that certain illnesses be healed to be the work of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit since some wonders might be the work of angels and/or fallen angels. One might have quoted Luke 9:49-50 well that nobody should stop those people that perform miracles in Jesus’ name. However, he should meditate Matthew 7:22-23 carefully again that the so-called people to use Jesus’ name to perform wonders might be rejected by the Lord. For instance, if these people that are mentioned in Matthew 7:22-23 to use Jesus’ name to perform wonders are the work of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit, there should not be any strong ground for Jesus to reject them. However, Jesus will reject them despite they do perform wonders in Jesus’ name and there is a query the so-called wonders that they perform are from God. The following are the extracts: Matthew 7:22-23, “Many will say to me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you who practise lawlessness!’ 1) The following are the proves that angels could perform miracles healing and there are falling angels in the Scripture to be against God too:

John 5:3-4, “In these lay a great multitude of impotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.”

2) The following are the proves that Angels could perform marvellous wonders:

Luke 1:7, “And they had no child, because that Elizabeth was barren and they both were now well stricken in years.” Luke 1:13, “but the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for their prayer is heard; and they wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John”. Luke 1:18, “And Zacharias said unto the angel, ‘Whereby shall I know this? for I am an old man, and my life well stricken in years.” Luke 1:19, “And THE ANGEL ANSWERING UNTO HIM, I AM GRABRIEL…” Luke 1:20, “AND BEHOLD, THOU SHALL BE DUMB, AND NOT ABLE TO SPEAK, UNTIL THE DAY THAT THESE THINGS SHALL BE PERFORMED, because thou believest not my words, which shall be fulfilled in their season.” Luke 1:22, “And when he came out, HE COULD NOT SPEAK UNTO THEM”.

Matthews 28:1-2, “Now after the Sabbath, as the first day of the week began to dawn, Many Magdalene and the other Mary came to see the tomb. And, behold, THERE WAS A GREAT EARTHQUAKE, FOR AN ANGEL OF THE LORD DESCENDED FROM HEAVEN, AND ROLLED BACK THE STONE OF THE DOOR, and sat it.”

Acts 12:23, “Then immediately an angel of the Lord struck him, because he did not give glory to God. And he was eaten by worms and died.”

3) Angels could appear in somebody’s dream:

Matthews 2:19, “…an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph…”; Matthew 1:20, “…an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream…”

As angels could perform wonders, are there any strongest proves to show that those wonders in contemporary Charismatic Churches are from God? If someone in contemporary Charismatic Church could prove it, we have to accept it. However, if nobody could prove whether the existence of wonder in contemporary Charismatic Churches is from God or the Holy Spirit or Angels, there is a danger that one would comment that certain wonders are from God or from the Holy Spirit or from Jesus Christ and, in case if they are not and it would turn up that we have forced God or Jesus Christ or the Holy Spirit to bear the name of doer and indirectly we have abused the name of Jesus Christ or God or the Holy Spirit and this causes us to speak against Jesus Christ or God or the Holy Spirit indirectly.

Could contemporary Charismatic Church claim that the miracles and wonder they perform in the name of Jesus Christ, is accompanied by correct teaching (in accordance with God’s Word) and righteous living?

A good Christian performs a wonder through the name of Jesus Christ in the Church. Many audiences would claim that this be the work of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit. As fallen angels could perform wonders, i.e. Buddhists could perform wonders as it is listed in the Internet too. What if the wonders in contemporary Charismatic churches are not from God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit, the surrounding audience that claims to be the work of the Holy Spirit/God/Jesus Christ, would have indirectly abused the name of each of them even though they might not be the one to do it and it indirectly causes the defamation of the name of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit and they might have grieved as a result of the whole church speaking against them since they might not do it. The abusing of the name of Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit/God would cause the audience to commit continual sins as when and they address these be the work of God.

Can a Christian or a Catholics claim that he has followed the correct teaching and righteous living when day by day and month by month and year by year seeing people keep on claiming the wonders in contemporary Charismatic Churches to be the work of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit without telling them the danger that they would have sinned against God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit what if the so-called, wonders, might not be their work then?

For holy bark, you could see people running around the churches crazily to bark here and there.

For Holy laughter, you could see people laugh without stopping.

For manifestation of the Spirit, you see people roll from one place to another without knowing what he/she has done after performing.

All these are not mentioned in the book of Acts.

A number of people in the church mention that they receive revelation from God through words of knowledge, prophecy, tongues speaking, words of wisdom. Many prophets arose previously claimed that year 2000 and 1987 were the end of the world. However, the year before year 2000 and 1987, none of these people that claim to receive so-called, special gifts of the Holy Spirit, say that these years 2000 and 1987 are not the end of the world. If it is the work of the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit should have informed all these people to correct their mistakes.

LUKE 9:49-50 ABOUT THOSE THAT DO NOT FOLLOW JESUS BUT COULD PERFORM WONDERS IN JESUS’ NAME

Luke 9:49, 50 (TCNT), “Hereupon John said: “Sir, we saw a man driving out demons by using your name, and we tried to prevent him, because he does not follow you with us.” “None of you must prevent him,” Jesus said to John; “he who is not against you is for you.”

Were these people that were mentioned in Luke 9:49-50 to be the disciples of Jesus since it is mentioned that they did not follow Jesus?

The following are the verses to prove that God’s people would surely follow Jesus:

John 10:27, “My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.”

John 10:3, “To him the porter openeth, and the sheep hear his voice; and he calleth his own sheep by nam, and leadeth them out”.

From the above verses, it is obvious that the sheep will surely follow the shepherd, Jesus.

As the phrase, he is not against you is for you, is mentioned in Luke 9:49 instead of the phrase, he is not against you is for me Jesus, it does not show that all these people that could use Jesus to perform miracles were for Jesus but for us, disciples, especially Jesus had mentioned clearly in John 10:27 and 10:3 that Christians would surely follow Jesus. The possible interpetation for Luk 9:49 for him to mention that they were for us that it might be that they could assist us in bringing outsiders to the attention of Jesus Christ for our evangelism. However, they are not for Jesus since they do not follow Jesus since they would definitely follow Jesus if they are for Jesus.
Indeed the people as mentioned in Luke 9:49-50 that could perform wonders in Jesus’s name were not God’s people or else Jesus should have included these people ont top of the twelve disciples. Or in other words, if these people that could perform wonders in Jesus’ name were God’s people, there would be more that twelve disciples instead of remaining to be twelve all the time during Jesus’ mission and it proves the fact that Jesus’ name could be abused to perform miracles. Or in other words, despite these people as mentioned in Luke 9:49-50 were not following Jesus and were not the disciples of Jesus, they could use Jesus’ name to perform wonders.

CASTING OUT DEMONS MIGHT NOT NECESSARILY CAUSE ONE TO HAVE DISTURBED BY DEMONS AS MENTIONED IN ACTS 19:13-16:

Matthew 17:15-16, “Lord have mercy on my son: for he is lunatick, and sore vexed: for ofttimes he falleth into the fire, and oft into the water. And I brought him to thy disciples, and they could not cure him.” Matthew 17:18-19, “And Jesus rebuked the devil and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour. Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, ‘Why could not we cast him out?’ ” Matthew 17:21, “Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.” From these verses, it is obvious that the failure in casting out demons might not necessarily cause one to be disturbed by demons as that is mentioned in Luke 9:49-50.

PROOF THAT ANGELS COULD PERFORM MIRACULOUS HEALING AND THERE ARE FALLEN ANGELS TOO:

John 5:3-4, “In these lay a great multitude of impotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.””

From John 5:3-4, it shows that angels could heal various kinds of illnesses whether they are blinded, halt and withered. As angels could perform miraculous healings and there are so-called, fallen angels, it is irrational to jump into conclusion that certain illnesses be healed to be the work of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit since some wonders might be the work of angels and/or fallen angels.

One might have quoted Luke 9:49-50 well that nobody should stop those people that perform miracles in Jesus’ name. However, he should meditate Matthew 7:22-23 carefully again that the so-called people to use Jesus’ name to perform wonders might be rejected by the Lord. For instance, if these people that are mentioned in Matthew 7:22-23 to use Jesus’ name to perform wonders are the work of God/Jesus Christ/the Holy Spirit, there should not be any strong ground for Jesus to reject them. However, Jesus will reject them despite they do perform wonders in Jesus’ name and there is a query the so-called wonders that they perform are from God. The following are the extracts:
Matthew 7:22-23, “Many will say to me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you who practise lawlessness!’

]]> By: Romans 126 http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14862 Romans 126 Tue, 14 Jul 2009 13:40:07 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14862 In an earlier post I questioned what fruit can we see from Todd and his teachings, earlier this year we saw a small slice when it was revealed that he was having an adulterous affair, some fruit to have whilst in leadership! I am personally not very surprised at that but I am most dismayed that those who support him and mentor him are more concerned at getting him back into ministry and getting him healed. I read with a lot of dismay that the poor wife and children who were abandoned by Todd don't seem to be getting much healing, help or support from the Todd Bently ministry "engine". Yes God forgives all those who put their faith and trust in Jesus of that I have no doubt but I question the wisdom of putting Todd Bently back into the very limelight that seems to have weakened his ability to obey God and honour his wife. In an earlier post I questioned what fruit can we see from Todd and his teachings, earlier this year we saw a small slice when it was revealed that he was having an adulterous affair, some fruit to have whilst in leadership! I am personally not very surprised at that but I am most dismayed that those who support him and mentor him are more concerned at getting him back into ministry and getting him healed. I read with a lot of dismay that the poor wife and children who were abandoned by Todd don’t seem to be getting much healing, help or support from the Todd Bently ministry “engine”.

Yes God forgives all those who put their faith and trust in Jesus of that I have no doubt but I question the wisdom of putting Todd Bently back into the very limelight that seems to have weakened his ability to obey God and honour his wife.

]]> By: Jonathan CHM http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14861 Jonathan CHM Tue, 14 Jul 2009 01:13:56 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14861 HOLY LAUGHER, HOLY BARK, HOLY DRUNKARD & ETC. Holy Laughter, holy bark, holy drunkard and etc. are not found in the book of Acts during the Pentecost. Some Charismatic churches might use the word, leap, laugh, drunkard and etc. from the Old and New Testaments to support these movements. However, bear in mind that the word, leap, laugh, drunkard and etc. are mentioned instead of the full phrase of holy laughter, holy bark and etc. What if these practices are not from the work of the Holy Spirit, the insisting that these practices are from the work of Holy Spirit has caused one to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit and it would have grieved the Holy Spirit to accept the wrong saying that these are the work of them. However, the Holy Spirit does not do it. One has indeed blaspheme against the Holy Spirit by abusing the name of the Holy Spirit despite he does not do it. The blasphemy against the Holy Spirit cannot be forgivable according to the New Testament DEFINITION OF BLASPHEMY IN HEBREWS/GREEK blas’-fe-mi (blaphemia) in classical Greek and Hebrews means primarily ‘defamation’ or ‘evil-speaking’in general; ‘a word of evil omen’, hence, ‘impious, and irreverent speech against God’. The above is the extract pertaining to the meaning of blasphemy in Greek. Consider carefully about holy bark, holy laugher and etc. For instance, if these are not the work of Holy Spirit, the abusing the name of Holy Spirit by saying that these are the work of Holy Spirit is indeed delivery of irreverent speech against the Holy Spirit. For instance, if these are not the work of the Holy Spirit, the insisting that these should be directed from the work of the Holy Spirit might have abused the name of the Holy Spirit and caused defamation of its name and one might have in turn grieved the Holy Spirit since these might not be the work of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit might be ended up to bear the name for the doer of holy bark, holy laugher and etc. What if it has grieved the Holy Spirit by insisting that these are the work of the Holy Spirit, our ignorance has ultimately caused the ultimate abusing and/or blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. HEALINGS IN CONTEMPORARY CHARISMATIC CHURCHES In miraculous healings among Charismatic churches today, we could easily spot out that many sick will fall down before the healers lay hands on them. However, many sick would remain unhealed after the rally despite they did fall down before the healers, i.e. Pastors that perform miraculous healings. God is definitely powerful and can heal all kinds of sicknesses. However, there is a deficiency in the healings in contemporary Charismatic world. What if the wonders are not the work of the Holy Spirit, the commenting to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit that it is he that does the work might have grieved the Holy Spirit in case if these are not the work of the Holy Spirit and it ends up that one has abused the name of the Holy Spirit and has ultimately blasphemed against the Holy Spirit. ALL BLASPHEMIES WHETHER TOWARDS THE HOLY SPIRIT OR GOD OR JESUS CHRIST ARE TO BE CONSIDERED AS SINS Matthew 12:31-32, “Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the BLASPHEMY AGAINST the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speak against a word the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever SPEAK AGAINST the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.” As the phrase, speak against the Holy Spirit, is mentioned in Matthew 12:31-32 with the phrase, blasphemy against the Spirit, it implies that a person blasphemes against the Holy Spirit even if he speaks against the Holy Spirit. The same for abusing the name of the Holy Spirit in which it might have grieved the Holy Spirit to accept the false saying what if the works are not from the Holy Spirit. The word, forgiven, is mentioned in Matthew 12:31-32 with the phrase, every sin & blasphemy, it implies that all blasphemies are to be considered as sin or else why we should need God’s forgiveness for the blasphemies. The same in abusing God’s or Jesus’ name to support their miracles are from God or Jesus respectively and these are the acts of blasphemies to be considered as sins too. THE WELL-KNOWN VERSES IN MATTHEW 7:21-23 Matthew 7:21-23, “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you who practise lawlessness!” What are the elements could be found in these verses above? There are: 1) They believe in Jesus Christ since Matthew 7:22, “(mentions that) Many will say to me..’LORD, LORD”. These people must have believed in Jesus Christ or else how they could call Jesus Christ to be their Lord as mentioned above then. 2) These people could use Jesus’ name to perform miracles since Matthew 7:22, “(mentions that) Many…have..prophesied…in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?” 3) Will they be accepted by Jesus Christ? Matthew 7:23, “…I will declare to them, I never knew you; depart from me”. THE PRIDE AMONG CONTEMPORARY CHURCHES FOR THEIR NON-REPENTANCE This is my general discovery upon Charismatic churches: Some Charismatic churches might not repent in order to do away their so-called, gift, in the churches due to they feel thieir reputations are most precious than the truth of the Bible and that causes them to persist in the practice. However, bear in mind that the insisting the so-called, gift, in their churches to be the work of the Holy Spirit might cause them to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit and that causes them ultimately to blaspheme against the Holy Spirit what if the miracles are not from the work the Holy Spirit. The act of insisting to defend their reputation more important than the truth of the Bible has indeed violated the great commandment of the Lord. For Matthew 22:37, “(mentions that) Jesus said to him, ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.” The act of having a high preference for their reputations rather that upholding the truth of the Bible implies that his love towards his own reputation is more significance than his love towards God. For Matthew 22:37 has commanded us to put our love to God first instead of that has to be in replacement of our reputation. HOLY LAUGHER, HOLY BARK, HOLY DRUNKARD & ETC.

Holy Laughter, holy bark, holy drunkard and etc. are not found in the book of Acts during the Pentecost. Some Charismatic churches might use the word, leap, laugh, drunkard and etc. from the Old and New Testaments to support these movements. However, bear in mind that the word, leap, laugh, drunkard and etc. are mentioned instead of the full phrase of holy laughter, holy bark and etc. What if these practices are not from the work of the Holy Spirit, the insisting that these practices are from the work of Holy Spirit has caused one to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit and it would have grieved the Holy Spirit to accept the wrong saying that these are the work of them. However, the Holy Spirit does not do it. One has indeed blaspheme against the Holy Spirit by abusing the name of the Holy Spirit despite he does not do it. The blasphemy against the Holy Spirit cannot be forgivable according to the New Testament

DEFINITION OF BLASPHEMY IN HEBREWS/GREEK

blas’-fe-mi (blaphemia) in classical Greek and Hebrews means primarily ‘defamation’ or ‘evil-speaking’in general; ‘a word of evil omen’, hence, ‘impious, and irreverent speech against God’. The above is the extract pertaining to the meaning of blasphemy in Greek. Consider carefully about holy bark, holy laugher and etc. For instance, if these are not the work of Holy Spirit, the abusing the name of Holy Spirit by saying that these are the work of Holy Spirit is indeed delivery of irreverent speech against the Holy Spirit. For instance, if these are not the work of the Holy Spirit, the insisting that these should be directed from the work of the Holy Spirit might have abused the name of the Holy Spirit and caused defamation of its name and one might have in turn grieved the Holy Spirit since these might not be the work of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit might be ended up to bear the name for the doer of holy bark, holy laugher and etc. What if it has grieved the Holy Spirit by insisting that these are the work of the Holy Spirit, our ignorance has ultimately caused the ultimate abusing and/or blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

HEALINGS IN CONTEMPORARY CHARISMATIC CHURCHES

In miraculous healings among Charismatic churches today, we could easily spot out that many sick will fall down before the healers lay hands on them. However, many sick would remain unhealed after the rally despite they did fall down before the healers, i.e. Pastors that perform miraculous healings. God is definitely powerful and can heal all kinds of sicknesses. However, there is a deficiency in the healings in contemporary Charismatic world. What if the wonders are not the work of the Holy Spirit, the commenting to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit that it is he that does the work might have grieved the Holy Spirit in case if these are not the work of the Holy Spirit and it ends up that one has abused the name of the Holy Spirit and has ultimately blasphemed against the Holy Spirit.

ALL BLASPHEMIES WHETHER TOWARDS THE HOLY SPIRIT OR GOD OR JESUS CHRIST ARE TO BE CONSIDERED AS SINS

Matthew 12:31-32, “Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the BLASPHEMY AGAINST the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speak against a word the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever SPEAK AGAINST the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.” As the phrase, speak against the Holy Spirit, is mentioned in Matthew 12:31-32 with the phrase, blasphemy against the Spirit, it implies that a person blasphemes against the Holy Spirit even if he speaks against the Holy Spirit. The same for abusing the name of the Holy Spirit in which it might have grieved the Holy Spirit to accept the false saying what if the works are not from the Holy Spirit. The word, forgiven, is mentioned in Matthew 12:31-32 with the phrase, every sin & blasphemy, it implies that all blasphemies are to be considered as sin or else why we should need God’s forgiveness for the blasphemies. The same in abusing God’s or Jesus’ name to support their miracles are from God or Jesus respectively and these are the acts of blasphemies to be considered as sins too.

THE WELL-KNOWN VERSES IN MATTHEW 7:21-23

Matthew 7:21-23, “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you who practise lawlessness!”
What are the elements could be found in these verses above? There are:
1) They believe in Jesus Christ since Matthew 7:22, “(mentions that) Many will say to me..’LORD, LORD”. These people must have believed in Jesus Christ or else how they could call Jesus Christ to be their Lord as mentioned above then.
2) These people could use Jesus’ name to perform miracles since Matthew 7:22, “(mentions that) Many…have..prophesied…in your name, cast out demons in your name, and done many wonders in your name?”
3) Will they be accepted by Jesus Christ? Matthew 7:23, “…I will declare to them, I never knew you; depart from me”.

THE PRIDE AMONG CONTEMPORARY CHURCHES FOR THEIR NON-REPENTANCE

This is my general discovery upon Charismatic churches: Some Charismatic churches might not repent in order to do away their so-called, gift, in the churches due to they feel thieir reputations are most precious than the truth of the Bible and that causes them to persist in the practice. However, bear in mind that the insisting the so-called, gift, in their churches to be the work of the Holy Spirit might cause them to abuse the name of the Holy Spirit and that causes them ultimately to blaspheme against the Holy Spirit what if the miracles are not from the work the Holy Spirit. The act of insisting to defend their reputation more important than the truth of the Bible has indeed violated the great commandment of the Lord. For Matthew 22:37, “(mentions that) Jesus said to him, ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.” The act of having a high preference for their reputations rather that upholding the truth of the Bible implies that his love towards his own reputation is more significance than his love towards God. For Matthew 22:37 has commanded us to put our love to God first instead of that has to be in replacement of our reputation.

]]> By: Bill Campbell http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14858 Bill Campbell Thu, 16 Apr 2009 13:05:28 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14858 John Crowder and “familiar spirits” =========================== Since scripture ALWAYS asserts DRUNKENNESS as UNRIGHTEOUS, then all drunken manifestations which are claimed to be from God are actually a MOCKERY of scripture, a mockery of Jesus Christ, and a mockery of the Holy Spirit. Prov 21:17 He who LOVES PLEASURE will become poor; whoever LOVES WINE and oil will never be rich. There is not a “Godly version” of drunkenness any more than there is a godly version of stealing, adultery or lying. 1 Thes 5:5-9 You are all SONS OF THE LIGHT and SONS OF THE DAY. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us BE ALERT AND SELF-CONTROLLED. For those who sleep, sleep at night, and THOSE WHO GET DRUNK, get drunk at night. But since WE BELONG TO THE DAY, let us BE SELF-CONTROLLED, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ. Since John Crowder and others manifesting in similar ways are being affected by REAL SPIRITUAL POWERS, and since their manifestations contradict REPEATING SCRIPTURAL COUNSEL against drunkenness and loss of self control, then the spiritual power MUST BE from Satan and his minions called “familiar spirits”, or demons. These are the spirit guides of New Age religion, the occult, and Roman Catholicism (eg. Mariology). Lev 20:6 And the soul that turneth after such as have FAMILIAR SPIRITS, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people. “Familiar Spirits” – see http://www.biblegateway.com/keyword/?search=familiar&version1=9&searchtype=all&limit=none&wholewordsonly=no John Crowder and those who follow his perverted ways have FALLEN IN LOVE WITH A COUNTERFEIT “angel of light”, “the God of this age”, and may have the same destiny: 2 Cor 4:4 The GOD OF THIS AGE has BLINDED THE MINDS of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. Spiritual drunkenness BLINDS THE MINDS of BELIEVERS! 2 Cor 11:14-15 Satan himself MASQUERADES as an ANGEL OF LIGHT. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve. Rev 20:10 And the devil, who DECEIVED THEM, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. Playing around with counterfeit “angels of light” might be BLISS and ECSTASY now, but if not repented of will lead to REJECTION by the Most High God FOREVER. The “big party” will occur in heaven AFTER WE DIE, not now (see Rev 19:9). Scripture asserts we now have SERIOUS WORK to do while remaining firmly SOBER. 2 Tim 4:3-5 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. But you, KEEP YOUR HEAD in all situations, endure hardship, DO THE WORK of an evangelist, discharge ALL THE DUTIES of your ministry. John Crowder and “familiar spirits”
===========================

Since scripture ALWAYS asserts DRUNKENNESS as UNRIGHTEOUS, then all drunken manifestations which are claimed to be from God are actually a MOCKERY of scripture, a mockery of Jesus Christ, and a mockery of the Holy Spirit.

Prov 21:17 He who LOVES PLEASURE will become poor; whoever LOVES WINE and oil will never be rich.

There is not a “Godly version” of drunkenness any more than there is a godly version of stealing, adultery or lying.

1 Thes 5:5-9 You are all SONS OF THE LIGHT and SONS OF THE DAY. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us BE ALERT AND SELF-CONTROLLED. For those who sleep, sleep at night, and THOSE WHO GET DRUNK, get drunk at night. But since WE BELONG TO THE DAY, let us BE SELF-CONTROLLED, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Since John Crowder and others manifesting in similar ways are being affected by REAL SPIRITUAL POWERS, and since their manifestations contradict REPEATING SCRIPTURAL COUNSEL against drunkenness and loss of self control, then the spiritual power MUST BE from Satan and his minions called “familiar spirits”, or demons.

These are the spirit guides of New Age religion, the occult, and Roman Catholicism (eg. Mariology).

Lev 20:6 And the soul that turneth after such as have FAMILIAR SPIRITS, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people.

“Familiar Spirits” – see http://www.biblegateway.com/keyword/?search=familiar&version1=9&searchtype=all&limit=none&wholewordsonly=no

John Crowder and those who follow his perverted ways have FALLEN IN LOVE WITH A COUNTERFEIT “angel of light”, “the God of this age”, and may have the same destiny:

2 Cor 4:4 The GOD OF THIS AGE has BLINDED THE MINDS of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

Spiritual drunkenness BLINDS THE MINDS of BELIEVERS!

2 Cor 11:14-15 Satan himself MASQUERADES as an ANGEL OF LIGHT. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.

Rev 20:10 And the devil, who DECEIVED THEM, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Playing around with counterfeit “angels of light” might be BLISS and ECSTASY now, but if not repented of will lead to REJECTION by the Most High God FOREVER.

The “big party” will occur in heaven AFTER WE DIE, not now (see Rev 19:9).

Scripture asserts we now have SERIOUS WORK to do while remaining firmly SOBER.

2 Tim 4:3-5 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. But you, KEEP YOUR HEAD in all situations, endure hardship, DO THE WORK of an evangelist, discharge ALL THE DUTIES of your ministry.

]]> By: taran ash http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14856 taran ash Sat, 21 Mar 2009 12:23:41 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14856 If you get this Caroline and Inny, be great to get in contact again, Taran and Kim If you get this Caroline and Inny, be great to get in contact again, Taran and Kim

]]> By: they think it’s all over…it is now at Jason Clark http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14484 they think it’s all over…it is now at Jason Clark Mon, 01 Sep 2008 11:47:14 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14484 [...] speed and life cycle of Todd Bentley has amazed me. I blogged about him in June, after so many people were asking what I made of [...] [...] speed and life cycle of Todd Bentley has amazed me. I blogged about him in June, after so many people were asking what I made of [...]

]]> By: Ken Everett http://jasonclark.ws/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Fjasonclark.ws%2F2008%2F06%2F10%2Ftodd-bentley-and-john-crowder%2F&seed_title=Todd+Bentley+and+John%26%23160%3BCrowder/comment-page-1/#comment-14375 Ken Everett Mon, 25 Aug 2008 21:23:02 +0000 http://jasonclark.ws/?p=2060#comment-14375 It's great to see so many people questioning. Questioning is good! Questioning is Biblical and pleases the Spirit of God. I love it that people say they are 'interested' but there's that 'little nagging something that just does not feel right'. Christians, disciples of Jesus, born-again children of God - we have a RIGHT to question. In fact we are URGED to TEST the SPIRITS and to compare every doctrine to the Gospel of the Kingdom that Jesus Christ preached about! We are warned to 'test the words of the prophets' and if their prophecies prove to be false, we should not fear the words of those prophets any more. I find it inexpressibly sad that so many people simply accept everything they hear from the pulpits.. Much like the Davidians (Waco, Texas) and the Jim Jones followers, so many people could lose their very souls because they lack a personal relationship with God our Father, in and through His Son Jesus, as we are led and taught by His Holy Spirit and fed on his Holy Word... People, your relationship with God Who fearfully and wonderfully made you, CANNOT and MUST not be based on your relationship with a pastor or a particular church body, because these are fallible and transient but God is everlasting and cannot ever fail. I pray that God will give His children the courage and discernment to test, prove and expose every work and worker of darkness. Do not be afraid of what 'men in powerful positions' might say or do, but rather exercise a numinous, awesome fear of God Who will never be mocked, will never share His glory with another and Who WILL at the end of time, apportion to each one according to his works. God Bless His children - woe to the foolish men and women who think they can hurt the Church that Jesus is building, and get away with it. It’s great to see so many people questioning. Questioning is good! Questioning is Biblical and pleases the Spirit of God. I love it that people say they are ‘interested’ but there’s that ‘little nagging something that just does not feel right’.
Christians, disciples of Jesus, born-again children of God – we have a RIGHT to question. In fact we are URGED to TEST the SPIRITS and to compare every doctrine to the Gospel of the Kingdom that Jesus Christ preached about! We are warned to ‘test the words of the prophets’ and if their prophecies prove to be false, we should not fear the words of those prophets any more. I find it inexpressibly sad that so many people simply accept everything they hear from the pulpits.. Much like the Davidians (Waco, Texas) and the Jim Jones followers, so many people could lose their very souls because they lack a personal relationship with God our Father, in and through His Son Jesus, as we are led and taught by His Holy Spirit and fed on his Holy Word… People, your relationship with God Who fearfully and wonderfully made you, CANNOT and MUST not be based on your relationship with a pastor or a particular church body, because these are fallible and transient but God is everlasting and cannot ever fail.
I pray that God will give His children the courage and discernment to test, prove and expose every work and worker of darkness. Do not be afraid of what ‘men in powerful positions’ might say or do, but rather exercise a numinous, awesome fear of God Who will never be mocked, will never share His glory with another and Who WILL at the end of time, apportion to each one according to his works. God Bless His children – woe to the foolish men and women who think they can hurt the Church that Jesus is building, and get away with it.

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