Atonement for a Sinless Society
5 May 2005
Atonement for a Sinless Society, by Alan Mann. Buy here
Alan is a good mate, and co-authored ‘The Lost Message of Jesus’, which catalysed some fevered debate about atonement theory and it’s place in our emerging culture. This book is drawn from Alan’s original Master reasearch back in 1999, and is not someone getting on the bandwagon to make money. Alan was working through this stuff before it was on most peoples radar for discussion.
It’s a great book, and imho the best part is at the end when Robert Parry critiques Alan and then Alan responds…it’s a geat dialogue.
So if you want to go a little deeper than just declaring atonement theory is pointless, or your conufsed about why it’s an issue, this book is a must have and read.
And for all you theologians out there Alan produces a thesis about Narrative Soteriology and Ontology that is easy to understand and powerful in application.
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Comment by edward pillar
11.29 am on 5 May 2005
Hi jason – thanks once again for another good book recommendation. It is ordered!
Comment by graham old
8.25 pm on 5 May 2005
Ooh, that looks good! I almost wonder if it might be a negative thing that Alan was co-author of TLMOJ. I can imagine some people intentionally not buying this ‘cos they think it *is* jumping on the band-wagon.
And that’d be a shame.
Btw, does he discuss Weaver at all?
Comment by Jason Clark
8.15 am on 6 May 2005
not sure Graham, I haven’t finished it yet. Jason.
Comment by alan mann
1.33 pm on 6 May 2005
sorry, no weaver as sadly i haven’t read his book yet – something i intend to rectify soon.
Comment by Whitewave
4.29 am on 7 May 2005
[snicker, snicker]
graham, you are so busted.
I am really ready to hear more about this.
I am glad that he’s been thinking about it for a long while before popping off with a book. While I recognise that the folks out there who still won’t learn to use a mouse need to have books to find out what is going on, I hate to see paper and press wasted on stuff that is being up and outdated as the minutes tick off. I’ve read a few books that have caught the wave and tried to get a handle on what they thought were big issues when by the time I’m reading it, those issues are proven small in comparison to the larger ones. Frustrating. Paid money for those books, now they’re really worth next to nothing. But I guess it’s inevitable in the fast paced world of emergent theology. (Little Orthodox Blasphemy humor, there. Sorry. I’m still miffed.)
Comment by andrew jones
8.19 am on 7 May 2005
interesting to see the similarities between the English discussion of TLMOJ and the Americans bickering . . i mean discussing . . McLaren’s book on hell.
Has anyone does a side by side synthesis of that?
Comment by alan mann
10.42 am on 9 May 2005
It’s fascinating what goes through your mind at 4.00 am when your trying to settle your 9 week old daughter. Last night it was Whitewave’s random post above.
Now I’ve become used to having the content of my books criticised over the last year or so, given their rather unorthodox nature – but being criticised because I use the book as my preferred outlet – now that’s a first.
Personally, I hadn’t previously been aware that this was such a problem. Sure there are limitations with books – but then there are limitations with any form of communication. And while I acknowledge that cultural change is pacey, I hadn’t realised that it, along with a theological response to culture and the general human condition, was as emphemeral as a mayfly!
I think there might be a bit of blog snobbery taking place, denying the reality that even in developed countries it’s still the minority who have access to the internet on a regular basis, making blogging and the information and ideas communicated through this medium an exclusive activity. Added to that, I know plenty of people who find the pace of technological advance alienating, isolating, oppressive and even de-humanising – issues that are oppossed to the purposes of the gospel. Perhaps my next book should be ‘Atonement for a Technological Society’!
I’m only guessing here, but I presume cinematic films are considered an acceptable creative process for the twenty-first century that expresses, comments on and disects the human condition, and yet when you factor in script writing, pre-production and post-production, they are probably a more protracted process than publishing a book. And there are a glutch of bloggers, Christian websites and books trying to trawl meaning from interacting with such a slothful cultural medium.
If you still beleive in the usefulness of books and film, however, then you might want to take a look at Simon Johnston’s recent post ‘The Garden State and the Human State’ on sijohnston.info where he combines insight from my book with the film Garden State to gain insight into the postmodern condition. How tragic that he didn’t realise how passe he was being.
One final note: We should be thankful that Whitewave has managed to hit the nail on the head with regards to the irrelevacny of God’s biblical revelation – God should have waited until the 21st century and adopted the immediacy of blogging as his preferred form of communication instead of adopting such an idadequate and outmoded form of communication as a book!
[NB - just incase the reader misunderstands: the above was written with slight tongue-in-cheek, as I have taken Whitewaves post to have elements of the same]
Comment by Whitewave
6.06 pm on 9 May 2005
That does it. I’ve become convinced that no matter how hard I work at being clear, I will always be misunderstood. And the harder I work at it, the worse it gets. Somehow I become someone’s worst nightmare.
Dude, I was SO trying to stick up for you in light of graham’s little dismissal, while at the same time deftly acknowledging one of the problems with books while giving you the benefit of the doubt about not being a band-wagon-jumper-oner. So much for deft.
You are projecting a GIGANTIC MONSTER onto me that isn’t there. I’m so sorry if it looks like I’m being a snob. That is the opposite of what I am doing.
I think what you need is some decent sleep. I know what mid-night feedings can do to a brain, and it isn’t pretty. I am not your nighmare.
The fact is, I was looking at it on Amazon to try to find their “look inside this book” section because I am thinking of suggesting it for our next Bookgroup reading (I read books), but they don’t have those pages up. I don’t even have a back-cover or side flap to read. Your publisher needs to do something about that, I guess. I’m pretty sure I wanna read it. Truly, I am really ready for this discussion to begin.
One of the questions I had (which is why I was looking for a Table of Contents or something…), if you’re not still too steamed at me, is do you look at how the Orthodox view the Work of Jesus Christ, since they don’t put much stock in the Atonement thing?
I didn’t wanna take up your time here if that info was somewhere where I could get at it, that’s why I didn’t ask before. But since I’ve apparently already ruined some of your peace of mind… Dude, I am so sorry. DANG!
Comment by J. Michael Matkin
6.37 pm on 10 May 2005
Hmmm, not coming out in the States until September. Some of you will just have to read it to me over the phone…
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